Courting the Hispanic vote

Bush's longterm election campaign machine is in full swing, with the announcement that he will push for changes in the immigration laws allowing legal status for some temporary immigrant workers.

This seems pretty squarely aimed at courting the Hispanic voting base, and, combined with Schwarzenegger stumping for Bush in the elections next year, may spell bad news for California's electoral votes. Let's hope Californians show more common sense than they did when they elected Arnie earlier this year.

Comments

Wow, thanks for pointing that out. Bush must be the only president ever to do something for votes. He probably does everything for votes...at least I'm sure we could find a political reason for everything he does...being the first president to ever do so.

[Del]

Dismantling the Democratic Party…

Yep Luke you’re right… Bush can be viewed as pandering to the ‘Latino’ vote.

It does go a lot deeper when taken in the context in his overall approach while being in office.

Before getting into that though – let’s just mention that Bush comes from Texas – huge Mexican influence. As far as sincerity – Latinos have infiltrated his own family!

Beyond that – if one is to look at this angle from a political perspective – Bush is DISMANTLING THE DEMOCRATIC POWER BASE!

Let’s be honest – the Democratic Party has relied on many different groups. Low – middle class – minorities – Unions – Blacks – senior citizens and etc… Reviewing the Democratic success in the recent past and it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out that this is where the Democrats have always garnered their strength.

Bush has decimated these power bases! He is a very shrewd politician though a lot of it is pure sincerity and honesty!

Remember – understanding how much a minority the Democratic Party is today – all one has to do is just garner a small percentage of any of the areas I listed above to gain momentum and win by a landslide. Keep in mind – this goes beyond just winning the upcoming election. What our President is envisioning is a changing of the mindset of our country – a much more powerful endeavor that will last beyond the upcoming decade.

Case in point – the recent Medicare legislation. He won the AARP! Do you realize what this means? He just guaranteed a portion of senior citizens to move to the Republican side of the house! This is monumental! This has always been a Democratic stronghold.

Now with his move to the status of illegal aliens – he is again gaining power where Republicans never had any! Trust me – this goes against the grain of the RIGHT! I for one do not side with our President on this issue – yet it will not stop me for voting for him come next election!

As dumb as everyone says our President is… as dumb as a fox!

Gotta love em’ !

no worries about us in CA, we collectively dislike the man's social stance. Arnold was different in that he is in tune with most of us on social matters, while Bush is not. He ain't winning the CA vote; I'm more worried about swing states.

[Chrish]

Beg your pardon but, Governor Gumby (Davis) here in CA also attempted to garner the Hispanic vote during the Recall by signing SB60, "Driver's licenses for Illegal Immigrants". Contary to what those in the Democratic Leadership would have everyone believe the Hispanic voters didn't fall for this blatent attempt at kissing their ass and the majority of Latino and Black voters voted in favor of Recalling him. They also rejected Bustamante, Davis' second in command, in favor of Arnie. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that the majority of us here in CA aren't happy with the Democrats. I have no doubt had there been a recall for all of the Democrats in Sacramento they would have all been thrown out of office and they should be.

The Democratic legislature here in CA is an example of what the Democratic Party has become. Self serving, pandering to Special Interest Groups, and pushing class dissention in order to get themselves elected or push their own agendas or that of the Special Interest Groups that own them.

It's also of interest to know that a few weeks before the Recall Election the A.C.L.U attempted to override the Will of the People by filing a lawsuit against the Recall essentially stating that "It would be unfair to those counties where the majority are of a Latino or Black persuasion as they are too ignorant or lack the intelligence to vote using the punch ballot or do not understand what they're voting for. THREE judges in the 6th Circuit Court of Appeal agreed and attempted to block the Recall. Also of interest is that the Three judges are known to be extreme left wing liberals. Fortunately due to the uproar that was created 11 judges decided to hear the arguments and all voted in favor of allowing the Recall to go forward as scheduled. The Will of the People won out.

As a side note after the elections it was reported that the majority of the problems with the voting occurred in predominately white communties while no voting problems occured in those counties that the ACLU was raising such a big stink about.... While the ACLU may deny it many of us and I'm one of them considered their lawsuit a form of reverse racism. "Too ignorant to vote because they are Latino or Black"?? If that's not a form of racism then what is?

As regards the changes the Bush is proposing I'm strongly opposed to it. I am all for immigration, my mother was an immigrant from Mexico. She, at an early age, came into this country LEGALLY. We don't need another amnesty what we need are tighter borders and adhering to the laws that have been established as regards Immigration.

We, here in CA, can no longer afford to pay for the social programs that the Liberal Democratic Legislature have put in place that caters to Illegal Immigrants. Nor do We accept the latest terminology for illegal immigratns being pushed by Democrats. Such buzz words as "Undocumented Workers", "Paperless workers". They are here ILLEGALLY and are accountable to the Law just as those companies or businesses that hire illegals should be held accountable.

If We are not going to follow the law then why not just close all of the border crossing stations, close down the INS, remove the laws regarding immigration, eliminate all the INS agents or border patrols and just let everybody who wants to come into this country come on in.

Heck why not just give CA, Nevada, Arizona, New Mexico, and Texas back to Mexico and be done with it?

[Chrish]

To {No Name},

Personally, I hope you're wrong and Bush does win the state of California. Being a Democrat, my party really needs a wake up call and a return to reality as regards the war on terrorism, their form of social programs, Illegal Immigration, and our Educational System.

We need more programs based on Helping people Up not on handouts, we need an educational system that TEACHES our children the basic's; reading, writing, and Arithmetic not "Self Esteem", not "Alternative Lifestyles", and not Bilingual Education. We need more concern with the citizens of our state/country than those who have entered this country illegally. We need more less out of control spending of our tax payer dollars and more spending caps, more intelligent and common sense wisdom and restraint in how and why their spending money.

We need to make it perfectly clear to those politicians in Sacramento and in Washington WHO really runs the Government. We, The People not them and not the Special Interest Groups nor the liberal elitist judges they've put in place who overide the will of the people at every opportunity.

The Democratic Leadership really needs a shaking and a wake up call because they are completely out of touch with Us, The People. The silent Mjaority are waking up and will be heard.... And about damn time....

[Chrish]

Luke,

All things considered I'll be the first to admit that it would appear that you were correct in your assement of Bush going after the Hispanic vote. Grant it he's not the first one to do that nor, I suspect, will he be the last. For my part I find it all disappointing for him to be doing it. I have nothing against immigration as I've said before my mother was a legal immigrant from Mexico but, Bush's plan is nonsense.

He's pandering to Special Interest Groups and, as
far as I can see, is also pandering to Vicente Fox, the President of Mexico.

This is nothing more than another amnesty and still does not resolve the root problem. We can no longer afford to pay for Illegal Immigrants.

[Del]

Though like Chrish I don't like the step that our President is taking towards immigration it’s clearly evident that the Republicans are making an attempt to destroy the Democratic Party as it stands today.

Just look at the recent moves Bush has done that has irked the power base of Republicans. The Medicare change is something that was always offered by Democrats but they never, ever delivered anything. Senior citizens were always part of the Democratic power base – with this one move Bush has garnered this group not only for his upcoming election but also for years to come! Heck AARP is backing Bush!

Look at the recent campaign reform legislation that was backed by the Supreme Court? I added a question mark because how the heck does the court have any power over blocking freedom of speech is beyond me. Again – here is another example on how Bush pissed off his power base, brought in others that never intended to back a Republican and still will win the election, not to mention it was another blow to the Democratic power base.

Above are three examples of things Bush has done, out of the ordinary that really wasn’t needed to win the election yet he did it. Why? The final destruction of the Democratic Party as it stands today. Heck it’s already been happening at the Legislative Branch (who owns Congress), now at the Executive Branch (recent banishment of Gov. Davis and refer to what Zell Miller ex-governor of GA says about the Dems) and is it just me that realizes that more and more the Dems only way out today is in the Judicial Branch (e.g. the recent court decision on campaign reform and the attempted steal of the last presidential election in Florida). Why do you think the Democrats are so vehemently against any nominee that Bush sends for appointment? How clear is the writing on the wall or am I hallucinating…

Just look at the Democratic debates, most recently this past Sunday and you can see that they are lost. President Bush is heading them off at the pass – stepping into and delivering to long established footholds the Democrats have had for decades. This plan will work because those that Bush is assisting will remember who delivered as opposed to those that always said they would and never did.

The Democratic Party Power Elites know this is happening. Headed by the Clintons – all they don’t want happening this upcoming election is a Dean win of the nomination. They cannot allow him to win because that will allow him to overtake those in power and put in his cronies. The existing power knows that they are going to lose to Bush – what they don’t want happening is losing power over the party. In their mind they will concede this upcoming election in order to re-group and prepare for 2008.

Folks we are witnessing the destruction of the Democratic Party while hoping that what evolves from the dust is a reformed party with a new base and a new plan for a better future. What that will eventually become is anybody’s guess.

This should not be a surprise to anyone. This happens and our history proves it. At one time the Democratic Party was for slavery. At one time they were against civil rights. It’s ok to admit that maybe the Dems today have lost touch with most of America and it’s time to be REBORN!

[Chrish]

Del, I really hope your correct in your assessment of Bush's "reformed" Immigration Policy. Only just recently another individual, Gov. Davis, attempted to pander to the Hispanic voters by signing into law "Driver's licenses for Illegal Immigrants" otherwise known as SB60. Guess what not only did Davis get booted out of office but, the majority of Hispanic voters voted against him. This Immigration reform could likely backfire in Bush's face as it did with Davis.

Contrary to what some Dems, Liberals, and Immigrant Activist Groups are saying the majority of the people, people being Hispanic, Black, Asian, and White, are against the idea of giving into any more of this. We can no longer afford to pay for it. Is Bush or the Feds going to pay the $4 Billions + what it is costing us here in California for illegal immigration, their health care, their education, etc., etc.? Frankly I really do not give a damn what Vicente Fox has to say on the subject he should be pressured to clean up his own country's economic situation instead of trying to encourage more illegal immigration. Of course Fox want's this to happen he's got much to gain from it. Considering his tax proposal was rejected by the Mexican Legislation and considering that the more immigrants, Illegal or otherwise, that he can get over here the more money they will be sending back to Mexico. So who really gains in all this except the Illegal Immigrants and the businesses who hire them at lower wages? We can no longer afford to be the world's HMO.

It's one thing to do another amnesty and let's be clear that's what this is, another amnesty it's quite another thing to do another amnesty with the following condition that our borders will be locked down so it will be that more difficult to cross over.

Reagan did it a little over 20 years ago and promised that the borders would be tightened. It wasn't and illegal immigration increased. They are estimating that we, here in California, have close to 8 million illegal immigrants. The majority of them are not paying taxes, are not paying into Social Security, not paying for health care but are using the resources that We, the taxpayers, are paying for. Considering that most work at less than minimum wage and the businesses that hire them pay under the table you can see where neither of them illegal immigrant nor employer would be paying taxes... So who really suffers for this? We do, The People, we wind up paying for it which seems to be the S.O.P.
(Standard Operating Procedure).

I for one would be more attuned to the idea that
1) Give the illegal immigrants 60 days to come in and sign up. After 60 days they would be deported no questions asked and no excuses. For the sake of Liberals I would even say 90 days.
2) Immediately send the National Guard to the borders to provide a second line for the border patrol.
3) Begin arresting and putting in jail with a hefty fine those CEO's or managers who are caught hiring illegal immigrants.

It seems that while everyone is bally hooing about the plight of the illegal immigrant nobody is asking about those who are trying to come to this country legally. What about them? Some of them have been waiting for years to come into this country by following the laws. Why should they be, in essence, penalized while those who are Breaking The Law are being rewarded? That seems, to me, to be completely Bass Ackwards, wouldn't you say?

We can't afford to be the world's HMO any longer.

[daniel]

If democrats lost so much touch how did they get several hundred thousand MORE votes in 2000 than the guy who sits in the white house? If they lost so much touch, why does bush think he needs 250 million dollars to stay in power? How exactly will the 3 million newly unemployed voters feel about working visas to hundreds of thousands of willing-to-work-for-nothing foreign nationals? Is that the long-standing foothold (labor) bush is usurping?

And a historical correction, the Democrats who did not support civil rights by and large BECAME REPUBLICANS AS A RESULT. Check the Dixiecrat story and then restate your thesis. Republican strength in the south today was predicated on opposition to civil rights.

And what is the form of a "new" Democratic party that you think would be a positive step, if every Republican position is already perfect? You mean to say 2 parties are ok as long as they are essentially both Republican parties? I'm not sure what your point is.

Last point, I'm grateful to Chrish for expressing his genuine views on the new bush immigration notion. However I generally disagree with Chrish's view that the Democratic party needs a wake-up call of a total republican stranglehold on our government. The wake up call has already been sounded and to go any further in this direction even for the sake of some phoenix concept, is too dangerous.

Put all of it aside, the politics, the medicare, the immigration, whatever your policy positions:

The democracy we have lived under is in great jeopardy.

That is what this is really about.
I fear what del rejoices in.

[Del]

Chrish your points are well taken and I agree overall.

My point is that this decision will NOT shake anyone away from Bush today. What other candidate does one vote for if said voter believes Bush is doing the right thing against terrorism and also with his cutting of taxes – fixing the economy? Because of the immigration choice – do you think this person will now vote for – Dean? Are you still voting for Bush?

Any one of the issues I brought up is not enough for anyone supporter of his to defect. He knows this and he knows this is biting at the Democrats.

For instance - now on the immigration issue and you can hold me to it – Democrats will say that he didn’t go far enough. They’ll complain that it doesn’t give immigrants what they deserve! Trust me – they are NOT going to say it was wrong. The Democrats are now forced to go even more EXTREME! Which will alienate even more away from their party! They know this and they still have no choice – Bush has once again beaten them at their own game!

Now do you see where I’m coming from?

Bush is picking different interest groups that have always been in the Democratic camp and is holding out carrots in order to take more constituencies away from the Democrats.

This is purely political – that’s what Bush is - a politician. He’s just a very good ‘dumb as a fox’ politician.

[Del]

Huh... Daniel - one quick note - Al Gore's father - a Democratic Senator was against civil rights...

Confused???

[Chrish]

Daniel, first of all I do not encourage nor would I want to see a "total Republican Stranglehold". I've already seen what a "total "Democratic" Stranglehold" has done here in California. We were on the brink of bankruptcy due to THEIR incomptence and complete mismanagement of taxpayer dollars and the states finances. To go the opposite way would be going from one extreme to the opposite and that would be just as bad.

Yes, I absolutely believe, the Democratic Party still needs a wake up call. Considering they didn't seem to get it here in California and still trying to play the "Business as Usual" game.
Refusing to accept the fact that they've made the majority of the people whether Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Green Party, Liberal, Conservative, or whatever angry with them only shows they still need a shaking....

Del, I do hope you're correct on this and quite honestly it does make sense but, am still concerned with it all. Considering this and throw in the fact that companies, i.e, AOL, IBM to name a few have started sending jobs overseas primarily to India, cheap labor, gives one cause for concern. As more and more jobs are shipped overseas to help their bottom line there are more and more of Our People out of work. If that's allowed to continue then who will be left to buy their bloody products? This country will consist of unemployed citizens and employed illegal immigrants. Who's going to pay the bills then?

[Del]

Daniel - no one wants a one party country.

It was never a question of having two parties for the sake of having two parties.

Today it seems that Democrats need to go in the opposite direction of what Republicans are doing because of where the strengths of the parties once stood.

The last 40 years – the Democratic Party touted being for the underdog – unions, affirmative action and pitting the lower against upper classes was the name of the game. Back then – yes much change was needed. There was much inequality in our country. And good things were accomplished.

Things have changed. I for one – being a minority can attest to what I speak of. This mindset is still very much embedded in the Democrat psyche. They just haven’t found another avenue and can’t seem to come up with a new one.

I don’t know what the Democrats can offer but I do know that what they are pitching today does not resonate with the majority of Americans. They are still stuck in a sixties mentality.

I can’t begin to tell you what they can do for instance to get folks like me to join their cause which is exactly what they need to do. Offer an alternative that captures the majority.

It’s just not there yet…

[Del]

Chrish you've got to have faith in our entrepreneurial spirit. It’s what makes this country so great! I for one have changed my skin more than once in my many careers always landing on my feet for the better and much wiser.

Can you imagine what a head of lettuce would cost if the only workforce available is our own lazy selfish citizens? Be honest – it would cost 10 times what it does today!

Take manufacturing into consideration… what do you think a television made entirely in the USA would cost?

My two examples above go from farming to manufacturing – what makes you think eventually – one by one – the same won’t happen to our other industries?

This is normal – it’s something that cannot be avoided. As Americans we should be glad that we are the top in the pecking order!

The beauty is that new industries are created every so often. Oh you hear people yelling about abuses in other countries due to our exporting of our industries but where do you think someone in an impoverished country is going to get a job? Trust me – they make lower wages because their standard of living is much lower. Many would not have any job if it weren’t for our exporting ours.

Back to our immigration issue and Bush’s plan – yes your points are valid. Like you I do have a problem with it. I’m still going over the finer points. As I mentioned earlier – I’m already hearing complaints from the left that it doesn’t go far enough if you can believe it! It’s not all doom and gloom. It seems that it’s another evolution that was inevitable and we need to gauge and monitor it.

All in all – change is good. Change is normal and those that cannot eventually die!

The law of nature!

[Chrish]

Del, I understand what it is you're saying however, I still do take issue with the idea of
a company sending their jobs overseas. I understand their reasoning "to cut their costs" but, would prefer they reduce the salaries of their overpaid CEO's. Let's face it CEO's, in general, make far more than they truly should
couple that with the mind boggling "bonuses" they get that's a bit much wouldn't you say?? When you tie that in their alleged "cost cutting" attempts which has been nothing more than reducing their work force, placing more of the load on fewer workers I don't see that they've really done enough for a company that calls for the amount of money they make.... It seems to me that it's now not just laying people off but, sending the jobs overseas reducing the chances of those positions ever becoming available in the future. Once again, I ask who suffers? With all due respect Del, following your logic to its ultimate conclusion would have all jobs overseas, reduced prices but, nobody really left who can afford their "reduced" prices because nobody would be working. I realize that's probably a stretch of the imagination but, since CEO's, board members, and managers are concerned with their bottom line, as they should be, it's not to far off to believe that they could or might just do exactly that in say 15 - 20 years. What then?
You look at the whole thing including those Special Interest Groups {Businesses, large companies, etc.} who are pushing this one can see where it is ultimately leading. This holds especially true when you read statements in the news saying "it will be good for businesses".

Like you Del, I've also changed my skin several times and would make the adaptation again if necessary but, with all things considered seems to me there are a lot of people who would have difficulty making the change and don't see why they should have to suffer such a thing while those who are Overpaid and have created this situation should experience nothing due to their decisions. These aren't just the low end jobs I'm talking about Del, I'm talking about jobs that have taken people years of education, training, and honing of skills to get to a high level of competency in such things as technical, software development, etc. Are you saying that they, after hard years of study and work are just supposed to say "cool" and go find something else to do?

It has amazed me over the years to see some hotshot CEO get hired, immediately begin laying off people usually the workers not the chiefs and then after all is said and done brag about how they've increased the companies bottom line and gets a hefty bonus from the board of that company for a job well done. They cut costs sure but at what expense? I don't recall ever hearing nor reading about some hotshot CEO getting hired, NOT laying off people, increasing the companies sales and customer service thereby increasing the bottom line, have you? If so, then they are far and few between.

[Del]

Chrish…

Though from where we sit things look a bit uneven... I believe the system is one that transforms and changes. Is it perfect – no. But given the alternatives like more legislation – I’m totally against it!

I believe in free enterprise. Again do some take advantage – it happens more than we would like. Before the crash in the 1920’s – graft and corruption was hitting its stride. It’s part of a free enterprise society.

Greedy CEO’s like you mentioned are part of the system – have been – always will. The same system weeds out and curtails excesses when needed. Hence why we have shareholders. Like many I have shares of companies that I believe in and do the right thing. Late in the nineties – I got rid of some less desirable shares and yes lost a bit like many did. Again – part of the game – previous to the hit – I had made money. Now I look a bit deeper in the companies I invest in - beyond just the profitability issue. The recent re-awakening changed my mind on who to invest in. Things have gotten tighter.

Again the point is – these things are cyclical in nature – always have been – always will.

I don’t begrudge any CEO getting paid the monies they are contracted to receive. The board that are voted in by the shareholders, bless these contracts.

I’m for big business – personally in my career I’ve gambled my pay for a higher payback. It’s a risk I took and if it didn’t work out – I did not get paid. If I hit the mark – I got well rewarded. To some around me – it may have seemed a bit too much but I was the one that took the gamble so I deserved the payback.

Don’t misinterpret what I’m saying. CEO’s that deliberating steal should go to jail and those that get paid what they were contracted for deserve it. Go after the board – enlightened the shareholders – those are the ones that are responsible.

[Chrish]

I undertand your position Del, and yes I do hold the shareholders and board members responsible for paying out such ridiculous salaries. I also hold CEO's accountable for trying to show they are increasing the bottom line by laying off people when they should, in reality, be working on increasing their sales thereby increasing their bottom line.
But then, that's just this lowly person's personal viewpoint.

Regarding this revised Immigration Policy proposed by Bush I'm in complete disagreement with. Consider this possible scenario. While companies, big businesses, and owners are salivating over the possibility of cheaper labor they could be walking into a deep hole with their eyes wide shut. After the illegal immigrant is given this "amnesty" those same companies, etc. will be required by law to pay them minimum wage or better. Most likely the immigrant activist groups will then embark on organizing these newly legalized immigrants into unions who will then go on strike demanding higher wages, better working conditions, better health care and why shouldn't they? Those same companies, etc. will either give into their demands and lose their profits or, and most likely, will then turn to the newly arrived illegal immigrants, give them the jobs at the less than minimum wage. Those newly legalized immigrants now being out of a job will then go on umemployment insurance or welfare. Now whom do you think is going to lose out on this one or who's going to pay for it?

I realize we can't just go out and start rounding up 10+ million people and begin deporting them that's utter nonsense and would not be acceptable.
Surely there's a better way to deal with the problem of Illegal Immigration, isn't there? And, again, what about those who have been following the laws, the rules and are still waiting for their papers to be processed before they can enter this country? What about them? Who speaks for them? They've obeyed the laws and hey're still waiting. Now they're expected to sit idly by while 10+ million people who broke the laws, didn't follow the rules are put ahead of them in the processing? Is that really fair, is that really just?

I might be more tolerant of this whole thing IF, and that's a BIG IF, there were tighter controls placed on our borders and our border patrol allowed to do their jobs. I would even go so far as to have the National Guard placed on our borders to provide backup and support for our border patrols. I would also be even more tolerant of this whole thing if the current laws were strictly adhered to with owner's, CEO's, or managers who, after showing prove, knowingly hired illegal immigrants are put in jail and a hefty fine placed on them. They had an interview over the radio with a border patrol agent out of San Diego who stated that they, the border patrol, could do what needs to be done to tighten the borders and reduce the number of illegals crossing over but, weren't being allowed to do their jobs. He also went on to say that the problem is a lack of political will.

We're talking, according to latest reports, approximately 10 - 12 million people. Can you imagine the administrative and enforcement nightmare that will create? The INS can't even deal with the current number of applicants now they're going to throw another 10+ Million people at them? Another beauracratic boondoggle that WE will have to pay for.

I don't know how the talk is going in your area or other area's of the country regarding this latest policy but, here in California there are a WHOLE LOT of people who are particularly P__Sed off about it, aren't happy about, and are dead set against it and, believe it or not, there are also many in the Hispanic community against it.

Seems to me the ExpatsagainstBush won't have to worry about Bush getting reelected as he's liable to find he's put himself out of a job over this one. Consider Gov. Davis. He tried pandering to the Hispanic votes by giving driver's licenses to illegal immigrants and lost. The current thought is that that one act galvanized the majority of voters including those who don't normally vote or haven't voted to go out and vote against him. The rest is history. Is it possible that GWB is dooming himself by repeating history?

[Del]

Chrish I can't argue with the points you've made. President Bush could possibly be making a decision he will soon regret. To me it's a purely political decision and why he thinks he needs to make it at this point I believe is - his intention of completely eliminating the Democratic Party. There is no other logical reason for this move. It’s not something that is urgently needed at this time.

Now controlling our borders is something that should be done. I have a cousin who is a border guard in Texas and it raises the hair on the back of my neck when he remarks about what goes on.

I’m in a tough position – you know who my Senators are – ‘Chucky Schumer’ and yep – ‘Ms. Hillary’. I feel when I write to them it falls on deaf ears. I am composing a curt note for our dear President.

I feel this is what we can do. I just sent Bush a donation and I’m going to include in my note that if he persists with this issue – please send back my money.

[Chrish]

I also am at a loss as to why Bush thinks this needs to be done at this time or in this manner.
I've heard there's also some fairly strong ties between the Bush family and Vicente Fox, could that be another reason why Bush is doing this?

On the one hand I can understand the necessity of helping the illegal immigrants to become legal and perhaps there is no other way but, the timing seems suspect and the solution doesn't really seem to address the root problems. Tightening the borders, letting the border patrol do their jobs, and possibly putting more pressure on Fox to clean up his own countries economic mess and corruption rather than dumping it on us and expecting us to pay for it.

I don't know Del it seems confusing on this one and one that is not being accepted here in California.

I'm sorry you've got Hillary as one of your Senator's. I, for one, am not impressed with her or her actions.

I've got Feinstein & Boxer a perfectly lovely pair who seem to raise their heads up every now and then and make rather idiotic statements.
Top this one, if you can, during the campaign to recall Davis, Feinstein came out here and made the most asinine statement. She was peddling for Davis as was Clinton and other's and said "If you vote "Yes" on the Recall then you're a bad Democrat.". Can you imagine that? Nevermind the incompetent idiot in step with the Democratically controlled legislature drove our state into a $36 Billion Dollar Deficit, never mind that he signed power contracts that we will be paying for years to come at a higher price than we should. Never mind that he AND the same Democratically controlled legislature were ready to jack our taxes up higher to pay for their blatant mishandling of taxpayer dollars.

You would not have believed the circus we had here with all the top named Democratic Leadership coming here to stump for Davis. For me it was an embarrassing and rather disgusting scene of politicians spewing out a lot of garbage and hot air. It didn't work and We threw Davis out of office.

Regarding this Immigration Policy reform I'm at a loss as to what or why Bush is doing this and think this just might create a backlash against him.. I guess only time will tell.

[daniel]

The first story I read about this a couple days ago before any announcement, (AP, Reuters, not sure) seemed to be hinting that White House officials never planned or expected the policy to go anywhere, it was intended purely for PR. Even if he pushed hard for it in the next few months, it's hard to imagine anything would happen, but all he has to say is "well, you can see I was really pulling for you, but not everyone is as COMPASSIONATE towards all those poor folks in the world as I am."

[Chrish]

You may have a point there Daniel... But, then again something like it or possibly worse could be put in place. Considering there are several Democrats who've already been attempting to push "amnesty" but not calling it an "amnesty".
Also consider there are those who aren't happy with Bush's idea, go figure, as it doesn't go far enough.

But, as Del has pointed out in numerous other posts Bush could very well be "heading them off at the pass." and leaving them in the dust of their own confusion.....

[Del]

If ever there were an opportunity for a Democrat to unseat Bush - it would be a candidate that will go against this immigration move and press on protecting our borders!

70% of Americans are against this immigration move being made by Bush.

Of course – this will not happen. I predict that Democrats will start screaming that this proposed legislation isn’t enough – they’ll want more!

Go figure…

From ChrisH:

"We're talking, according to latest reports, approximately 10 - 12 million people. Can you imagine the administrative and enforcement nightmare that will create? The INS can't even deal with the current number of applicants now they're going to throw another 10+ Million people at them? Another beauracratic boondoggle that WE will have to pay for."

Sounds kind of like why Britain is pissed off about this new VISA rule.....hmmmm......

I will add....The obvious difference being that hopefully, the American VISA rules will increase security. But wouldn't legalizing illegal aliens do that as well? I mean, what's the thinking behind legalizing the aliens? What's the benefit (besides attracting the Hispanic vote)?

[Chrish]

{First No Name},

I really don't understand what all the fuss is about??? I've traveled. Not to sound like I'mb bragging but, I've been to Hong Kong, Japan, The Phillipines, England, Ireland, Italy, Greece, The Island of Cypress, India, and lived in Israel for four years. Some points of entry were a breeze, stick a piece of paper in front of the agent and they'd stamp it while other's took a few moments to ask questions. The only place where I found it tougher was in Israel. Trust me, you've never been to a Visa office until you've been to an Israeli Visa office. I had to regularly renew, if I recall correctly, every year and it was an experience to behold. You could count on spending at least 2-3 hours in one of their offices, if you were lucky. And, if you weren't a new immigrant coming to live in Israel they would really put you through the wringer... Ah
yes, something one would always look forward to with enthusiastic joy.....

OK, so what if they're planning on taking a picture, a fingerprint, or whatever else they're planning on doing. What's the big deal? You spend a few extra minutes getting processed?

If all of the countries of this world were to implement the same measures I, for one, would have no problem with it, and would not feel as though I'm being inconvenienced or bothered.
The only thing from my viewpoint is that it would mean adjusting for the amount of time it will take to go through their processing.

Oh, that's right, my apologies we're extremely busy people and we can't be inconvenienced by such time consuming activities as that now can we?